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    Thread: Idles fine, but stalls/dies at 2000+ rpm - long post, please help

    1. #1
      What's wrong with my car?
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      Idles fine, but stalls/dies at 2000+ rpm - long post, please help

      I've been searching google and this forum for a couple of days now and done some work to my car, but to no avail. I am not particularly experienced at any kind of automotive work, but I do consider myself "mechanically inclined" and tend to be a fairly quick study (and my experience has steadily been increasing, but consists mostly of coolant system and brake work as well as oil changes).

      Here is my situation:
      I have a 2006 Aveo with about 95,000 miles on it. It had been running well up until Saturday morning (today is Monday - timestamp) when, shortly after exiting the highway, it began to buck and lose power. My CEL came on, I pulled over, and checked for cracked vacuum hoses. Finding none, I went to a nearby Autozone to check my CEL.

      I got a p0300, p0301, and p0304 - misfires for random, cyl 1, and cyl 4 (listing possible causes of ignition system, vacuum leak, injector fault, high or low fuel pressure). Being 1 & 4, I went ahead and bought a new coil and headed home. At this point the car bucked a little every time the RPM dropped for gear change (auto trans, btw).
      About 2 miles from my house (after driving about 15 miles to the Autozone and 13 miles back), I lost all power and puttered at about 2 mph and then the engine died. I pushed it up into a parking lot where I connected the new coil, but because I didn't have any sockets, I just unplugged the original coil and plugged in the new one without mounting it (not sure if it required grounding or not). I was able to start up, but when I tried to accelerate, I had no power and if I let off the pedal, my car would buck and die. I puttered over to another Autozone just a few hundred yards away and checked my spark plugs, which were pretty well soaked in oil. I hadn't changed the plugs but once and many years ago, so I figured there could be a minor leak in the valve cover, but probably only minor - something to deal with later)

      I retrieved my sockets and tools and went ahead and replaced the plugs, plug wires, and properly mounted the coil (noting that I did get some oil into the chamber, but thinking it would burn off easily enough). Still would idle fine, but have very little power, and would die upon relieving the gas pedal.

      I could hear a loud hissing and found that it was coming from the EGR valve, but not at the mated surface, but between the solenoid and the body, like around the standoffs. I put electrical tape around it there and I could no longer hear the hiss, but the problem still occurred. Thinking my tape job just sucked, I went ahead and bought a new EGR valve and as soon as I turned on the engine, I could again hear the hissing from the same location, and the problem still persisted, so I took it back off and they let me return it for full refund.

      At this point, I had left my car there overnight and was consulting with the Autozone guys and one noted that I had a lot of white smoke coming from my exhaust when I was driving and showing him the symptoms. I mentioned that I probably had a little oil in the chamber and we checked the plugs, which were once again soaked.

      I towed my car back to my house so I didn't have to keep operating in the AZ parking lot and changed the valve cover gasket. Now, I did not drain the oil in the pan because I just changed it 3 weeks ago, but the oil I could see and the parts it was covering looked fine, but there was a small amount of frothy yellowish oil in one section on top of the inside of the valve cover. I didn't think much of it then and considered it was probably just condensation, but please let me know if it is more serious and/or possibly related.

      I also thoroughly cleaned out the combustion chambers of any oil, re-cleaned the spark plugs (brand new, but oiled up pretty good; cleaned with TB cleaner)
      I used throttle body cleaner on all the hoses, the one plug, and around what I take to be sealing surfaces on the air intake manifold, seeking a vacuum leak, but could not find one. I could not get to the back side of it however, so a leaking gasket has not been ruled out, in my opinion.

      In park, I removed the intake hose (which I found had been cracked for some time before taping it up last time I changed the air filter, approx. 3-4 months ago) and had someone slowly rev up to about 2000-2500 rpm and watched the throttle blade. It seemed to suck strongly in idle, gradually open with throttle, but when the engine kicked and died, the blade opened up wide. I could not tell which happened first and neither do I know what is correct function, but it seems to me that it was somehow looking for MORE air.

      The last symptom that seems to have developed and is quite possibly unrelated to anything other than the violent shuddering of my engine is a metallic rattle in one of the bodies in line on my exhaust as well as what I would consider an excessive amount of condensation/water coming from the tail pipe, sometimes accompanied by very fine black deposits. No I haven't driven through any water lately and it's not a constant stream, but occasionally it will spurt and then drip. I haven't seen it with my own eyes, but after holding the revs at about 2000, I had wet concrete with black spots (very "carbony"). The rattle seems to be in the middle body in the pipe assembly, (possibly a resonator?); the one before the muffler.

      This afternoon/evening, I will have access to a fuel pressure gauge and a compression test gauge. Can anyone tell me what the fuel pressure should be at the rail?
      If pressure is good, then I'd like to check the fuel injectors. Is there any "easy" way to do this? I was thinking I'd unhook the plugs to them one by one to see if there is any change. I would think that no change means bad injector.
      I also will check the timing belt and make sure the marks are where they should be.
      I will also check to see that each spark plug is actually firing and check fuses.
      On an '06, is the fuel filter integrated in the pump? And is the pump actually in the fuel tank? I can see two items connected to the fuel tank, both behind it. One is a rectangular box shaped item, and the other a canister that I found to be an EVAP valve. Is the rectangular part the pump, or something else?

      I know it's been a long post and I appreciate y'all looking it over for me. It was my intention to be as thorough and specific as I could. Any suggestions or knowledge you can give me will be much appreciated!
      Thank you
      Adam



    2. #2
      I'll keep it and add a turbo USAFzac's Avatar
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      I'm sorry to hear about your problems. Your pump is in your fuel tank, the filter hooks up underneath it. Have you tried to run it with the new plugs? And you didn't mention if its overheating. Not sure how much help I can be, but I know you gotta replace the valve cover gasket, those plugs sounded fouled. Do a compression test if you can

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      Temp has been and remains normal. I have replaced the valve cover gasket, but only after the brand new plugs ran in oily condition for a short time. Would they be ruined that quickly? Visual inspection had them looking okay, but the problem still persists as it did before. I will try a compression test this evening, hopefully.

      So I should be able to change out the fuel filter?

    4. #4
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      Fuel pressure at rail said 55-60 psi.
      Sounds high to me, but what would high pressure indicate?

    5. #5
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      Checked each spark plug by pulling the out, grounding, and turning on ignition- all firing

      Checked compression. Each reached about 190-200, but 1 and 4 jumped up there after a few cycles, whereas 2 and 3 got there a little quicker. I've never done a comp. test before, so I'm not certain what's normal. Also, should I rev the engine while checking compression?

    6. #6
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      The symptoms seem to be getting worse. Now it is having a harder time starting, it doesn't handle being revved at all, and the intake manifold is vibrating so much that it sounds like a helicopter (it had not been doing so before). The rattle in my exhaust has also intensified and even moved. It is now further along near the muffler just before the coupling flange. I am considering removing that entire section of pipe (looks like two flanges and at least two hangers; I haven't gotten a good look). If there is a partial blockage in the tail pipe, would that cause my symptoms? Something breaking loose inside could explain the rapid onset of this problem (as opposed to symptoms slowly revealing themselves and getting worse over time, as it may have if something was wearing out or clogging up)

    7. #7
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      Just FYI if you see white smoke after start-up that stays low to the ground that usually points to a blown had gasket or worse a cracked or warped head . Pull dipstick and clean it. Crank it up and let it run and watch the white smoke then turn it off and pull the dipstick and check it for a yellowish watery oil. By the way the problems you describe all lean in that direction.
      There are many quick fix's out there but if I were you and it is a head gasket I would use steel seal. YouTube it for yourself and you decide. I replaced the head gasket on my daughters 2005 aveo when the thermostat housing cracked and she ran it HOT.. and she has been having the symptoms you describe, radiator bad, she ran it hot Again. So I am going to try it myself this time. Hope this helps

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      its very possible that in your attempt to fix the other problems and allow oil into the cylinder you fouled your o2 sensor.

      i would check and clean that before going further. (any chance you have another code at this point?)


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      The o2 sensors are the ones before and after the catlyric converter, correct? I will pull them tomorrow.

      Wewaman, since I cleaned the ignition chambers, I have not gotten any more heavy smoke and my dipstick oil has been clean. Btw, my thermostats housing blew up on me a few years ago, too. Fortunately I was in my neighborhood and was able to push it home. As I recall it was a particularly cheap part, destined to fail from the beginning.

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      Quote Originally Posted by ATWork8803 View Post
      Checked each spark plug by pulling the out, grounding, and turning on ignition- all firing

      Checked compression. Each reached about 190-200, but 1 and 4 jumped up there after a few cycles, whereas 2 and 3 got there a little quicker. I've never done a comp. test before, so I'm not certain what's normal. Also, should I rev the engine while checking compression?
      It sounds like you're doing the compression test with the engine running - is that correct?





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