NEW Camshaft Actuator Solenoid but no voltage at the connector

[trucheli]

NEW Camshaft Actuator Solenoid but no voltage at the connectors

The two Camshaft Actuator Solenoid are new, but I got zero voltage on the connectors, on either intake/exhaust, what could be the problem?
code P0014 and P0011

[trucheli]

[OG-Lou]

I don't know if my answer answers your question.

I don't know for sure but my understanding is voltage only goes to the cam when the (ECM) computer decides to send voltage there. I am suspecting at idle or with the key on, there is no voltage because the computer (ECM) determines when the engine is running, how much oil goes into the cam sprocket for a given situation.

It might require a lab scope to measure the voltage pulses. Hand help volt-ohm meters generally do not register voltage pulses (on time).

How they work might help you determine what happens and how the system works. The following website is mechanic training level.
Variable Valve Timing

[trucheli]

Thanks OG-Lou, I do have a Lab Scope and I did try it while I was cranking the engine, I hope is not the ECM, cause if I change it probably I have to do a ECM relearn and I don't have the tools to do that.
But if it is the ECM I would get a different error code right?

[OG-Lou]

My understanding of a simpler variable valve timing (VVT) set up is there is no voltage (signal) to the VVT solenoids at cranking speeds. The amount of advance or retard at the initial cranking /engine starting should be zero because the advance -retard functions all depend on oil pressure, which requires a running engine.

Sometimes these codes are the result of dirty or contaminated engine oil, so is the oil clean?

Assuming the P0011 and P0014 codes were set while the engine was running at operating temperatures, I don't have any experience with that situation. I just mentally try to imagine what is happening with the engine at different RPMs and at different operating temperatures and loads, with the various sensors.

Both codes indicate an over advanced camshaft position.

From OBD-2 Code Web page https://www.obd-codes.com/p0011
P0011 - "A" Camshaft Position - Timing Over-Advanced or System Performance (Bank 1) (inline engines only have 1 bank)
Incorrect camshaft timing
Wiring problems (harness/wiring) in intake timing control valve control solenoid system
Continuous oil flow to VCT piston chamber
Failed timing valve control solenoid (stuck open)

P0014 - "B" Camshaft Position - https://www.obd-codes.com/p0014
Timing Over-Advanced or System Performance (Bank 1)
Incorrect camshaft timing
Wiring problems (harness/wiring) in intake timing control valve control solenoid system
Continuous oil flow to VCT piston chamber
Failed timing valve control solenoid (stuck open)

Here is a link for A person with 2008 Malibu with a 2.4l engine (no solutions)
https://www.obd-codes.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=10698

Also a VVT Youtube video from a very reputable aftermarket parts manufacture with an automotive technician training program.
https://www.engine-codes.com/p0014_chevrolet.html


My experience is ECM's get blamed way too often and rarely are the problem. Some-many things can be tested with basic tools if you know how and take the time.
Car electronics are so complicated and require some special tools.

Some questions:
Have you taken anything apart or did these codes just show up?
How many mikes on the car and what year?

[trucheli]

Thank you OG-Lou for taking your time to answer me.
I got the car from somebody that replace the head gasket put it all back together, the car would not start and gave up and sold it, so I got it cheap. 2011 AVEO with 61 k miles
I did an oil change, yes the oil was very dirty.
I put two new camshaft actuator solenoids,and I drain the old oil out of the camshaft phaser gears, later I make sure the timing is all synchronize, I don't know how can it be Over-Advanced, if is not the ECM the other thing that can be bad are the camshaft phasers but they don't usually go bad right?
I do have sparks on the spark plugs and I hear the full pump.

I think I found the problem.
One more thing that I just realize looking at some videos on the internet, I have a misaligned CMP sensor reluctor on the intake camshaft compare to the videos.
I guest the previous owner somehow moved it when he did the head gasket? IDK.

I let you know how it goes.


Thanks again

[OG-Lou]

OK, with the work that was done it tells me it might have run OK sometime before the head was taken off.

I don't think the phasers go bad but I never talked to anyone read about them going bad. I saw videos of them being taken apart and they look like should be OK with just some cleaning or flushing of some type.

There is a tool kit to reestablish the proper positions of each camshaft when the engine goes back together. How did you determine the camshaft along with the crankshaft positions are correct?

I read some place that if the cam sprockets are off more than 1 1/2 degrees from factory settings the car will show an error code. I am just guessing, but if the cam sprocket sensors are installed in a little different position or angle, this could trigger a code. Would the engine still run OR fail to run, I don't know. I have read just removing and reinstalling the same crankshaft sensor requires a special tool (Tech-2 or similar diagnostic device) relearn procedure.

In my opinion being 1 1/2 degrees is so little I wouldn't know how to measure it. That is too technical for me with the tools I have. I suppose with one of the high priced diagnostic readers, it might be something that can be measured or recorded. It also could be something for a "re-learn" procedure. Not having some of the pricy diagnostic tools is a road block. One thing you might do is to do a cranking compression test.

I changed the timing belt on my 2008, checked the timing marks 4 or more times a couple of different ways and got 2 different codes the cam and crank shafts were not in time. I never touched the crankshaft sensor but I did unbolt the camshaft sensor when I changed the timing belt and related parts.

I worked and worked on things, looking for something I didn't do correctly. I re positioned the one and only camshaft sensor to the right and left ever so slightly (maybe a 32nd of an inch) until the engine didn't buck at low RPM and moderate acceleration. The engine runs fine now but I still have a code every now and then. On a 2008, messing with the crankshaft sensor requires a relearn. Supposed no relearn is required for a camshaft sensor BUT I suspect it does require something like a re-learn with the Tech-2 or similar diagnostic tool.

FYI The chart or list you post #2 is too small for me to read and even after I copy it, and enlarging it makes it unreadable.

Does the engine run and how well?

[trucheli]

I check the timing marks several times, I even took out the spark plug on cylinder #1 to make sure in on TDC.
NO, engine will not run at all.
Cranking compression test is a good idea, I'll try that tomorrow.
I move the intake sprocket/reluctor on the intake camshaft to the best I could guess, then I erase all codes, and now the scan tool does not show any new codes, I only see the old pending codes.
Still no running engine at all.

Thans OG-Lou

[OG-Lou]

I am assuming the 2011 engine is the same as 2009 engine as far as the head and camshafts are manufactured and timed.
There are 2 videos regarding the 2009 engine. In the first video, stating about at 1:04 there is a camshaft and phaser alignment took he said cost $100. eBay has a similar kit for around $20 something up to over $100 for the same kit depending on who is selling it. The guy also talks about other problems he encountered with the camshaft and phaser assembling process.
This is part one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrTS3M2OIyc
There is a part two https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjRp0IrllQg

Tool kit https://www.ebay.com/itm/EWK-Timing-...EAAOSwX1la1vpL

Here is a non-English video of some of the special tools that would be helpful. Just look at the pictures
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGqHyDpfdWU

[OG-Lou]

I know I haven't addressed the no voltage to the cam phaser solenoids because an engine at rest has no oil pressure so why would there need to be voltage to the solenoids at cranking or start up.

About videos and tools- procedures, starting at 1:08 to 3:28 and beyond shows how the camshaft and cam sprocket tool is used properly. Like I said before, the video might be a little different than your engine but the principals applies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlWcnb6ilS8